Dialing in the system at my uncle’s- Dali Subwoofers

Last week I had the opportunity to visit my relatives, due to the relaxed rules (before the KTV cluster)

He is also one of the “them” using the Rythmik ported and KK high pass Low pass :man_facepalming::man_facepalming::man_facepalming:

Again I have to stress, this is not the way to dial in the system ! It sounds absolutely horrible using this method to integrate the system . At no point in time one should consider this approach when dialing in the system, it’s just inferior in many ways and there is so much flaws with this approach . We really need to “move away” from this mindset of Low pass and high pass

The first thing we did, was to offload the Rythmik ported LVX12 subwoofers, it just couldn’t blend in with the KK12 subwoofers. Same problems were evident everywhere with this approach. We kept the KK12 subs, tons of timing issues and spectrograms were indicating world :earth_africa: map. The Kk is still the king of midbass, no doubt about it. We confirmed it as well measuring the transient response of the subwoofers in comparison with the Dali subs

We went with the corner stacked approach instead of splitting them left right for the balance . ( stacked subs is just so different)

Stack is the the way to go for ultimate tactile response, this is what I advocate for subwoofers placement, multiple subs , stack , stack, stack… it’s the right approach, especially for HT

To our surprise, the bass is phenomenal now. After stacking and pairing the KK12 which was situated at the right hand side , before we started any Audyssey eq, we tested live by night bullet scenes. Immediately we knew the approach was right and bullets were piercing with accuracy with superb decay

By the way, at my uncle’s place, the biggest improvement was observed with vibration control. Not room noise, electrical noise, not cables, not power conditioners, not High end DACs or DACs that measured well at ASR. It was plain simple, vibration controlled had like 40% impact to the entire sound

This convinced my uncle to focus on getting the Gaia for the speakers, and to go with the hifi racks.

This is his room layout below, huge improvement with the Gaia and the hifi rack, well worth it

These Dali’s are one of the best subs for it’s price, seriously the most under rated subwoofer of the century! We tested, svs, rel, JL, somehow my uncle likes JL but price was steep. He loved the line array but again price was steep. So demoed a few and to our surprise, this little Dali fella had so much bass articulation and bass was like sweeping left right up down, very articulated and bass steering was excellent ! Timing was superb and so was transient attack. It still couldn’t beat the KK12, but it’s pretty close

Kk12 is just on another league with the bass hitting head chest levels

And yes, for the umpteenth time, once the bass integration is completed successfully, one would just automatically use subwoofers for music. This is evident again, my uncle being a full range music guy, has now switched to music 2.1 , with the kk12 at right, and the stacked Dali at left, the bass is just on another level. Not that the Dali opticon is incapable of producing bass, with the headroom given to mains speakers, the performance just leaped to another level with Low frequencies duties being passed on to the subs

This were all accomplished without any acoustics in the room, time alignment technique is still the best approach

Ps:// we have completely re eq’ed audyssey to exclude subwoofers eq. Audyssey really spoils the bass and dynamic eq just didn’t sound right again! Confirmed again and again, dynamic eq is not the way… the use of mindisp with manual EQ and integration provided the quality, clean, precise, fast and articulated bass

House curve approached is still favourable. Once I have done it for my uncle, he was so convinced that he is now from full range music guy, to music 2.1 with dual subs flanking and from audyssey dynamic eq to house curve guy… almost all who experienced this approach, no longer looks back….

Will share along the way, how we integrated the system. I now have a decent collection of data from most HdB rooms in Singapore. After sometime, u know certain things work the way it’s meant to

Yes ! And we XO at 100hz! Again there is no way anybody could tell where the subwoofers are located … lol

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Nice work. Not easy to integrate diff subs. What model are the dali subs

The E12 F. If your godpa also using Dali speakers, he can consider this model. Check it out man, very good bass articulation, fast and nice. Doesn’t extend down to 20hz, rolls off at about 28-30hz if I recall correctly….

But very good quality from 35hz up to 100hz when stacked

I’ll pull up and share the details of the measurements before and after etc, very good response and timing as well

Ron has been singing praises on the Dali sub since we audited the SVS together the last time. :grin:

After u mentioned the dali e12f, i went to check the dali website to see what subs they have

Interesting. Now they have a 14 inch sub offering.

But what’s more interesting is, they have this 3 driver subwoofer in the P10DSS. White paper here, i like what was written:

Elsewhere , 14” with the Dali rubicon, this pics from overseas users ….

This Dali speakers and subs are very good, very surprised to learn about its performances… decently priced

The main speakers, in full range mode, also sounds quite good, bass is impactful, not bad I found . I love the ribbons also, quite nice from the Dali

It’s a very good feeling, when u know u have successfully made someone happy with their system

My uncle is a very happy man now, I’m glad I managed to help him dial in the system

He is also a firm believer now, playing music with subs now ! The bass is full and rich with music, surprisingly good and not boomy and loud

But you will observe, he is missing the Low frequencies, as evident in the 12” subs , but he is still much happier because of the articulation in bass, speed and accuracy.

Conclusion is no point having bass that can dig deep if one cannot control the bass. It was loud, but lack quality with the Low bass, there is no room treatment in his living room… it ended up becoming worse with a subs that is not suited for the environment

In 2020 he was even having problems and was complaining bass is boomy even with the KK subs and only certain movies sounded good

I was pretty sure it is the room, because I’ve measured the Kk12 subs and it’s got the lowest distortion, from 30hz up at max 100db SPLs. So I know the problem is audyssey calibration , somewhere wrong ….

I’ll try and share the details , before with the previous subs and now the new subs and we can see what’s the differences and why it sounded good now, compared to last time…

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That’s the k-14 F

Not bad the subs :+1:t2:

Your uncle bought the k14?

He didn’t, settled down for the 12, price was 2x, so imagine getting two of this would have been $4k plus

But we all know it should have some decent quality, having experienced the smaller little brother , for music and HT very good

Bryan, i found Dali speaker are good. I like the sweet ribbons tweeter. They do have a much expensive Epicon series. The Rubicon are one step lower than the Epicon. Heard the Oberon and Rubicon at kaydee6(Michael) house. From Oberon and Ribicon the SQ sound is more controlled and better on the Rubicon.


Ya it’s very good, my uncle is using the opticon, he seems to love it.

We found the biggest upgrade came with the change of the footers, to isoacoustics. Very solid improvements after the change

I just demoed the legacy reference at Tritone and the Piega line source

The legacy is beautiful sounding speakers

They had their legacy behind AT screen, decluttered front stage and the screen right towards bottom, what a pleasant experience .

Super love the ribbons from the legacy as well. They are very very fast in transients , fully sealed design.

I’ll be checking out the epicon soon. Together with thr magnepans as well. Contemplating making the switch to new speakers soon… legacy speakers seems to be top now in my list

I have the Legacies. I love it.

I heard the Piegas, still prefer the Legacies.

I own Studio HD before, then home trial the Classic HD before settling on Signature SEs for the LR. Silverscreen HD and Expression AT complete my setup.


I concur ! I heard the piegas too. 3 of us had a listen, one of my friend prefers the Piegas and another the legacy. I prefer the legacies, you cannot get that type of transient attack from any dome tweeters. They are extremely fast and best part it doesn’t have that “metallic” sound . No fatigue and the highs are so airy and silky smooth.

The timing is superb and crossover nicely done. The transition from mid to upper mids is very good.

I love that legacy speakers

Then came the centre channel, vocals tracking on screen actions was superb, very very good imo. Effortless and precise. What I love about it is the neutral sound and accuracy. Very natural

Envy you bro !! Hahahaha

I might join you

Lol…come join

I believe they have the Marquis HD in that setup. I might swop the Silverscreen to this after I settle my stereo setup. Marquis HD seems like a better match for the Signatures and Focus.

You audition the Focus SEs?

It was the signature, but very impressed indeed.

We tested this clip below with the marquis centre

Very impressed , vocal tracking on screen action was solid. Loved it! Very good centre speakers.

The sound signature is similar to the signature speakers , so can achieve good coherence.